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Updated: Heated public meeting on Holywell Mead (From Bucks Free Press)
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Updated: Heated public meeting on Holywell Mead
10:56pm Tuesday 13th October 2009
EMOTIONS ran high as more than a hundred residents and councillors attended a public meeting to discuss the future of the closed Holywell Mead swimming pool.
About 120 people packed into The Environment Centre on The Rye for Tuesday evening's meeting, which was chaired by the Holywell Mead Trust Steering Group's Neil Bailey.
Mr Bailey told the gathered crowd how the group had formed, studied successful outdoor pools around the country and had a Business plan reject by Wycombe District council because it 'wasn't viable or sustainable'.
He said the group was currently working on a new plan to put to the council but called for more people to help the activists' campaign and fund raising efforts.
Wycombe District Councillors, including leader Lesley Clarke and deputy leader Tony Green, attended the meeting to put across the council's side of the matter.
They said the council were “forced to make difficult decisions” over the closing of the pool in a bid to save money and added it had postponed council plans for the facility to “give the steering group a chance”.
He added the average number of swimmers visiting the centre had fallen from 26,000 visitors in the 1980s to 13,000 this decade, which played a part in the council's decision.
Cllr Green told the meeting that the council was now drawing up plans for an alternative leisure facility to “work alongside The Rye's highly successful children's play area”.
He would not tell residents what the proposed facility would be, but confirmed it would not be a pool and added a public consultation would be held over the plans in due course.
Councillors were regularly heckled and jeered through out the meeting – with riled residents questioning why there had not been a public consultation over the council's decision to close the pool.
Cllr Green said the council did not hold public consultations on “every matter” and added that alongside the pool closure and other cost saving measures, several council staff were made redundant “but we didn't ask you (the public) which staff members you wanted us to lose.”
Angry attendees called for the council to actively help the steering group put together a workable business plan, while others asked why “money is available for a new facility but not available to fund the swimming pool”.
Cllr Jean Teesdale said she had met with the group on many occasions but “couldn't see a plan she could support”.
She added that she would be “delighted” if the group could produce a plan and challenged the residents to “prove me wrong”.
Lib Dem member Julia Wassell then took the mic to say the publicly-saved Micklefield Library was proof that “a dream and hard work can make a difference.”
She then claimed a consultation over the council's proposals for the site would be a “sham” and told the group to “keep fighting”, handing them a cheque for £300 towards the campaign.
Cllr Clarke then told residents the pool would cost between £300,000-£400,000 to keep running and said council tax would have to rise to subsidise the pool – which she called a “drain on finances”.
She added the council had been “very fair” to the steering group but its business plan was “sadly wanting and we wouldn't be able to work with someone without a plan.”
She abruptly left the stage moments later after a member of the public questioned the council's plan and handling of the pool saga.
Before the meeting closed, a member of the public asked for a show of hands for those who wanted a pool to be included in the council's public consultation - the vote was unanimous.
Councillors did not show their hands for or against the vote and would again not be drawn on proposals for the closed leisure facility when further pressed by residents.
The meeting ended with a round of applause for the councillors for attending the public meeting and answering questions from residents.
After the meeting, Cllr Trevor Snaith said the turnout at the meeting had “yet again shown the weight of public opinion against the council's closure of the Holywell Mead Pool.”
He added: “The council have been offered an opportunity to come back to the table and work with residents and the steering group to get the pool reopened - as a Pool.
“WDC needs to show their commitment by allocating officer resources to the project and show real intent to reopen the pool by working in partnership with the group and residents.
“The group could then move forward with charity status and start the work of fund raising.
He added that he 'believed' the council “have access to LABGI (Local Authority Business Growth Incentive)funds which could be reallocated to resource this project.”
Cllr Snaith and fellow Liberal Democrat member for Ryemead, Cllr Ray Farmer, added there should be a 'cross party initiative' to re-open the pool “for the good of the people of High Wycombe.”
The council said today that using LABGI funds to run pool had been discussed and it was decided that it would not be an appropriate use of the funds.
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Your Say YourBucks
wayneo, bucks says...
12:30am Wed 14 Oct 09
To not disclose plans at this stage is nothing more than a disgrace, they are using OUR taxes and we have a right to know what it is being spent on. Consultations are a waste of time for stakeholders are often Council departments and local businesses that have an interest, Consultations are often ignored.
Clarke and Green have to go before this town is screwed for future generations.
yog, says...
12:32am Wed 14 Oct 09
Great turnout for a public meeting. Well done to the pool campaigners for arranging it.
demoness, Hades says...
6:29am Wed 14 Oct 09
We really need a strong opposotion in this town to get this council out because otherwise there will literally be nothing left. But there is NOT one and that is a huge issue.
Okay - so the council is short of money ( or so they say). That might be understandable if they didn't keep spending it on hare brained schemes.
Neil Bailey Save Holywell Mead Pool, High Wycombe says...
8:45am Wed 14 Oct 09
Thanks for attending, helping and participating in last night's public meeting - it was a pleasure to meet so many people who care about their community and were giving up their time to support this very important issue to our current and future generations.
How sad that we are still facing the pool being demolished and we still are no wiser as to what it will be replaced with - however we know it will NOT be a pool - and we know that a pool will not be an option in any future use
How sad that the steering group (which is simply a local community group who care about the local community facilities available to us all) is still being treated as a hostile supplier bidding for a business opportunity - our intentions are simple - channel the goodwill of the local and wider community for the benefit of the local and wider community by supporting the pool and sustaining it's present and future direction
If you care about our pool, the wider Holywell Mead and Rye area and something for our community to use and gain pleasure from - I am afraid now is the time the town needs your help - please support the steering group's work and please voice your displeasure at how this whole issue is being managed
My heartfelt thanks to all those supporters last night and all those who have given up many months of their time to support this issue
With thanks
Neil Bailey - Chair - Holywell Mead Pool - Steering Group
Save Wycombe, High Wycombe says...
8:58am Wed 14 Oct 09
DeepThinker, Wycombe says...
10:11am Wed 14 Oct 09
Ofcourse, their point of view is always the "correct" one and we, as citizens of Wycombe District, obviously haven't got the intelligence or the expertise to see that.
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
10:26am Wed 14 Oct 09
Lesley you and your cabinet dont represent the interests of our town and what the people of High Wycombe want-- START LISTENING AND START ACTION ON WHAT PEOPLE WANT AND ARE TELLING YOU !!!
angeloftheuk, marlow says...
12:44pm Wed 14 Oct 09
kazza290, Stokenchurch says...
1:08pm Wed 14 Oct 09
'Cllr Snaith and fellow Liberal Democrat member for Ryemead, Cllr Ray Farmer, added there should be a 'cross party initiative' to re-open the pool “for the good of the people of High Wycombe.” '
lets assign this to the hospital rather than a decreipt old pool which should have been closed years ago.....I for one do not want to be paying more on my council tax just so that pool can open.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
1:42pm Wed 14 Oct 09
kazza290 wrote:Also as a council tax-payer, I disagree with you about the pool but agree about the hospital.
frankly I am not bothered if we get the pool open again or not....I am more worried about the services or lack of at the local hospital - THAT REALLY IS WHAT WYCOMBE DESERVES ..AND NEEDS.
'Cllr Snaith and fellow Liberal Democrat member for Ryemead, Cllr Ray Farmer, added there should be a 'cross party initiative' to re-open the pool “for the good of the people of High Wycombe.” '
lets assign this to the hospital rather than a decreipt old pool which should have been closed years ago.....I for one do not want to be paying more on my council tax just so that pool can open.
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However - Wycombe is being stripped of civic, municipal assets and facilities by uncaring self-interest groups at local and county level.
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It's all part of the same strategies and tactics plotted by short-sighted small-time petty politicians.
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That's why the pool is just as important in its way as the Hospital.
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These devious cunning ill-intentioned oligarchs get their way by divide and rule methods ie by splitting the local folk's opinions by cherry picking areas to attack.
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Don't let the wicked scoundrels get away with it. Unite we stand otherwise we'll lose everything - not just the pool and the hospital. It's all part of the same picture, I'm afraid
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Regards
bernaaard, Downley says...
2:19pm Wed 14 Oct 09
Since when did the term servant include dictation ?
Personally i think there are a lot of schemes we wee that are approved for money, that a lot of us, and i mean a lot, would rather not see funded. As a result, should that money not be used according to what the populous want, and in this case that means the swimming pool ?
bernaaard, Downley says...
2:39pm Wed 14 Oct 09
dobs, high wycombe says...
3:10pm Wed 14 Oct 09
Save Wycombe, High Wycombe says...
3:30pm Wed 14 Oct 09
tom.marlow, marlow says...
3:36pm Wed 14 Oct 09
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
3:40pm Wed 14 Oct 09
Save Wycombe wrote:You're right SW ; so much for our so called 'democracy'. These creatures just ignore local folks wishes and aspirations.
I'm afraid you cannot sack them until 2011
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Our day will come , perhaps too late. It took Chicago 17 years to get rid of Al Capone. In the meantime he caused all sorts of havoc, despair, poverty, syphoning off of resources (and even death).
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Let's hope these local political gang members internecinely cause their own demise and leave us to get on with our lives with some of our faculities still intact.
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Regards
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
3:47pm Wed 14 Oct 09
tom.marlow wrote:Yes , t.m because one has to be a gang member, otherwise - No Chance.
And I bet they all get re-elected in 2011
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That's what happened to Independents who didn't have the parties' machines and resources sponsoring them.
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The system has been hijacked by vested interests beyond the boundaries of the Town and Bourough.
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Regards
PS I've cured the 'v' problem btw (for the moment)
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
4:06pm Wed 14 Oct 09
yog wrote:Yog - WDC Tory councillor consultations are a sham. They simply ignore what people say and then do what they want, which normally is cuts more cuts and selling off of Town heritages!!
The pool has to be included in the public consultation for the future of the site. That way it will be seen as a fair consultation otherwise it will be an expensive sham. Great turnout for a public meeting. Well done to the pool campaigners for arranging it.
They never put what people want first as they do not support the believe of providing community service for the Town of High Wycombe.
Otherwise the pool would be open!
pabstock, wycombe says...
4:10pm Wed 14 Oct 09
dobs, high wycombe says...
4:17pm Wed 14 Oct 09
pabstock, wycombe says...
4:22pm Wed 14 Oct 09
eadpool.org.uk/our-s
upporters/
Farmer Pickles, says...
5:12pm Wed 14 Oct 09
I may have misheard and stand to be corrected but after what I saw last night nothing would surprise me.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
5:24pm Wed 14 Oct 09
pabstock wrote:I don't think these arrogant but stupid councillors care or will take the slightest bit of notice of the citizens of this area. I think like demoness,Hades implied they have already decided what They want - and the plans are in place.
Well said dobs. Will everyone who cares about the pool, please spread the word - we need to get even more people behind this excellent campaign. Please register your support and assist in any way you can: http://www.holywellm
eadpool.org.uk/our-s
upporters/
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They don't mind attend 'talking shops' pretending they are responsible democrats. No skin of their nose, is it ?. That's what all the political hypocrites do.
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They are in fact the self-appointed Taliban of this area of England (supported and sponsored by the Big Boys in London) and unfortunately they do anything they want. Not , repeat Not what we want. And we are stuck with the scoundrels ! And their wholesale wanton destruction of the Town over the years.
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This is now also true at nationally level. Our democratic system has become more corrupt and is under attack from within and without.
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Nevertheless I will register my support and assist if at all possible as you suggest.
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Regards
Oliver Newbury, says...
5:47pm Wed 14 Oct 09
-
It's because WDC covers a huge area. If it didn't, the people of Wycombe would dictate who ran the council. Instead, Marlow, Risborough, Stokenchurch and hundreds of other rich villages continue to vote Tory...
julianharty, Hazlemere says...
5:50pm Wed 14 Oct 09
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
5:54pm Wed 14 Oct 09
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But we've got to get rid of the rascals in a democratic way if at all possible otherwise we descend towards their low level of behaviour.
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Regards
boondoggle235, high wycombe says...
7:03pm Wed 14 Oct 09
realtory, Wycombe says...
7:30pm Wed 14 Oct 09
We need to look beyond our political ideals and recognise that however much we might be Tory through and through this bunch of idiots is a disgrace to the town and to the Tory party. Next time round lets vote them out and knock them off their arrogant perches.
lidopraiser, pinions says...
8:34pm Wed 14 Oct 09
When a vote was put to include swimming pool as an option in a proposed consultation Cllrs Clarke, Green, Teasdale, Council officer Jewell did not vote against that idea. I do hope that is minuted.
demoness, Hades says...
8:48pm Wed 14 Oct 09
realtory wrote:I would vote for a tin of peas as opposed to this lot - I mean substutitute one lot of vegetables for another...
Trouble is round here you could have a tin of peas stand for election and if it was a Tory tin of peas it would win. We need to look beyond our political ideals and recognise that however much we might be Tory through and through this bunch of idiots is a disgrace to the town and to the Tory party. Next time round lets vote them out and knock them off their arrogant perches.
Plus ça change..., Wycombe says...
9:30pm Wed 14 Oct 09
N S W and E of the town centre - for really easy access and oodles of parking. In the outer areas of town.
What do the other 159,880 people in the District want?
Wycombe Marsh Rebel, High Wycombe says...
10:33pm Wed 14 Oct 09
Farmer Pickles wrote:She most certainly did, i was totally disgusted. If i had done that in my line of work i would have been fired, but no doubt she will get away with it as nobody will stand up against her. I know most political parties are as bad as each other, but it really is time for Clarke & Green to be voted out, before they totally destroy Wycombe.
Did anyone else hear Lesley Clarke tell a member of the public to p**s off as she went back to her seat? I may have misheard and stand to be corrected but after what I saw last night nothing would surprise me.
tom.marlow, marlow says...
11:07pm Wed 14 Oct 09
nannynanny, high wycombe says...
11:36pm Wed 14 Oct 09
Even as supporter of the pool, I hope for her sake she said "pool off" not "p**s off"
Save Wycombe, High Wycombe says...
3:33am Thu 15 Oct 09
demoness, Hades says...
7:11am Thu 15 Oct 09
EXCUSE me Mrs Clarke - okay maybe we wouldn't expect you to consult on which people you were making redundant - no doubt it would have been the most vulnerable and no one from your power base. BUT the closure of a public facility like the pool should have full public consultation.
Could you get anymore arrogant?
Well karma always catches up you know and what goes around comes around.....
lidopraiser, pinions says...
8:05am Thu 15 Oct 09
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
8:19am Thu 15 Oct 09
They refused to consult on Holywell mead Pool saying it was part of the Sports provision
They consulted on Imagine the future this year and again refused to include the Pool in consultation
Clarke and her Tory cronies avoided consultation on pool --- we know why !!!
Saying that consultations are a sham in Wycombe -- They do not act on resident feedback .They are hell bent on closing all facilities and selling off towns heritage
wicksandrea, marlow says...
9:49am Thu 15 Oct 09
wayneo, bucks says...
9:56am Thu 15 Oct 09
dobs wrote:You expose them for what they are. Expose their dealings and meetings with shady businessmen, you use the FOI act to obtain their emails and ask questions, obtain the information that led to the decision, who was involved, all the correspondence that led to a decision, ask them about the new plans and if they refuse, report them.
Representatives for the Hampton Open Air Pool and Chesham Pool were inspirational. Community spirit is apparently key to a successful project and the community turnout was impressive. In the face of so much possibility, Councillor Green had his fingers in his ears and wanted only to sell a defeatist argument and secretive agenda, which was utterly aggravating. How do we sack them and find a positive cooperative spirit?
The Council's constitution ensures that we are entitled to information, the Information Commissioner has the power to ensure they give us that information.
The Freedom of Information act is the best tool at finding out what is going on with your town, at finding out who the good guys are and at who the mongrels are.
Why else do they hate it so?
pooluser, High Wycombe says...
10:13am Thu 15 Oct 09
wayneo, bucks says...
11:58am Thu 15 Oct 09
Local politics used to about serving constituants, now, local Councils have given way to being local authorities who now rather than serving, have the power to dictate and enforce against us; why else can you be fined for transgressing rules imposed when receiving a 'service'.
To be fair, Councillors do not really have much of say in local politics, they don't listen to us because the real power has been devolved from local people to the Council Officers in the form of targets, arrogance and quite frankly ignorance of what people want; a dictat will come from central Government that will be followed by the letter, no argument, not fighting for us, just a bend over and take it attitude. The Government will offer money in the form of grants which can only be obtained by following strict rules about how the money's spent. This leads to budget constraints where money cannot be channelled or support other projects.
The above is not to say that money isn't being wasted hand over fist; Council tax has increased considerably to the point where it could be considered extortion, there is also income from fines and investments (cough cough), there is more than enough in the kitty,much however, is spent on consultants, salaries, pensions, non-jobs and 'projects' that are in the pipeline and of which we know nothing about.
I have no idea why Clarke and her cronies believe that big is always better, that we need shiny new leisure facilities, big stadiums, huge olympic size pools or whatever, Wycombe used to be famed for the quality of its furniture, if Clarke and Green are hoping that uge a mass of sports facilities and development will be their legacy, then i'm afraid they are deluded.
Sometimes, it is the smaller, existing things around us that count and that are held dear.
rbmissenden, prestwood says...
12:02pm Thu 15 Oct 09
DarrenHayday, High Wycombe says...
12:32pm Thu 15 Oct 09
:o(
DarrenHayday, High Wycombe says...
12:32pm Thu 15 Oct 09
:o(
sai-diva, highwycombe says...
1:01pm Thu 15 Oct 09
Are they both just career councillors?
They are obviously not trained in how to talk to people.
Any one contacted the national press about the disgraceful way that they are behaving? Private Eye have a soft spot for issues concerning 'rotten boroughs' and swimming pools.
Made me laugh when I read that clarke wasn't going to run for parliament as she felt that her gender would count against her. It's not your gender that'll count against you mrs. clarke, it's your attitude.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
1:04pm Thu 15 Oct 09
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They display a toxic combination of all the nasty attributes of :
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= Arrogance.
= Recividism
= Stupidity
= Egotism
= Holier-then-thou attitudes
= Orifice- instead of brain-led utterances
= Laissez-faire business acumen
= Elitism
= Short-sightedness.
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I know I don't have to spell out the above (initially) for you. Of course not - you're the ordinary sensible decent folk of this area.
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The last century experienced a lot of unpleasant dictatorial regimes where the people of some lands (and sometimes the world) suffered terribly at the hands of such creatures as Stalin , Hitler , Mussolini , Pol Pot , Moa Zedung etc. These odious dictators (of Right or Left - nodifference) turned on their own people.
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The closed oligarchic incestuous systems they presided over were deemed Communist or Fascist or Nazi etc.
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What is our currently democratic system turning into ? One of the first steps these politicos take is to ignore the people and close down facilities.
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Am I scared . Yes I am.
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Regards
wayneo, bucks says...
1:25pm Thu 15 Oct 09
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
1:28pm Thu 15 Oct 09
DarrenHayday wrote:YES you are right DH - a more important issue , but the NHS system is even more remote , oligarchic and even more non-democratic compared to the WDC shower of miscreants.
I wish that you guys would put this much effort into saving our hospital...
:o(
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People get the impression (rightly or wrongly) there's nothing they personally they can do , as the bureaucrats and county councillors deliberately keep themselves aloof and are vigorously protected by a 'well-oiled' PR machine.
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Correct me if I have got the wrong impression as I can see what's happening to Wycombe Hospital but it's a different political gang (same incestuous self-protecting party one may say) running things.
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Regards
DeepThinker, Wycombe says...
4:01pm Thu 15 Oct 09
nannynanny wrote:No, she definitely said the latter!
OMG! Farmer Pickles Even as supporter of the pool, I hope for her sake she said "pool off" not "p**s off"
It's what say when they don't get their own way and can't think of what else to say.
poolfan#101, High Wycombe says...
4:16pm Thu 15 Oct 09
If I was to speak to anyone like that during my line of duty I would be taken to task quite severley.
If this is true then one or more of those poeple who overheard her needs to report it to the standards commision.
Political figures have a duty to the poeple they represent and should show those poeple all due respect. Whether they agree with the comments being made they have no rigth to resort to jeuvenille obscenities.
I know the meeting was heated but these councillors chose to take the floor and make their voices geard, in doing so they should have fielded any comments and questions appropriately. If they didn't like what they heard so be it but that is no excuse to verbally assult members of the public.
How many more times are these arrogant demi-gods going to insult the paasionate people of Wycombe. If I had heard the reported comment I would not have hesitated in reporting her. A chance to put her in her place that is way too good to miss.
Come on the people of Wycombe, stand by your principles and prove that we are made of better stuff.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
6:02pm Thu 15 Oct 09
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One hears she doesn't want to be an MP. I don't believe you, Mrs Clarke !
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You give the appearance of being currently in training for it (allegedly).
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I like to think deep deep down some people could be quite nice really, under the limited circumstances.
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Regards to all Wycombe and District folks without exception.
wayneo, bucks says...
8:22pm Thu 15 Oct 09
towncryer, HIgh Wycombe town says...
10:43pm Thu 15 Oct 09
wayneo wrote:HAve to agree seems Tory councillors are whipped .
The annoying and sad thing is that many of these Councillors, when speaking to face-to-face, come across as quite decent people. They change considerably when under the umbrella of 'the Council'; I suspect that there is an 'organ-grinder' to which they pander and are subserviant; unfortunately, it's not the electorate any more.
Thank goodness we have Cllrs like Snaith,Wassell and Farmer who stand up for whats right for High Wycombe
angiestone, Booker says...
12:18am Fri 16 Oct 09
As regards the BFP Reporter not reporting that Lesley Clarke swore at us - I was sitting right next to him half way down the room and did not hear what she had said, so he probably did not. The fact that she stormed off and would not answer a question put to her shows the kind of person she is and I firmly believe she has now lost the Tory party a lot of votes in the next local election (especially the young vote).
Yes, I do wish that people had found as much energy and time to stopping the closure of services at the hospital. But that is a huge issue that forming a Steering Group would not have been feasible - it is hardly a Cottage Hospital!
I also find the fact that the councillors refused to reveal what the proposed plans for the area were and who would be providing them is nothing short of disgraceful. I just wonder if it is the same Leisure company who run Handy Cross and that is why they do not want another pool in competition!
demoness, Hades says...
8:15am Fri 16 Oct 09
And sadly they will be right. We need some good strong independent candidates who truly care about this town and are not alligned to a political party with an agenda.
I have made my feelings very clear on the motives of the lib dems. I do not know how anyone can say that Wassell is strong - she was labour, now she is lib dem. How do we know she might not change allegience again? In fact I bet she already has a party lined up.
As for the bloke who wants to be an MP and is also a councillor for Totteridge - well words fail me TBH. He is using Totteridge as a stepping stone to greater things. In the unlikely event of him becoming MP for Wycombe can we imagine him caring two hoots for Totteridge?
Now what about Labour? Sorry, do we have a labour party in this town? I have never seen any evidence.
That leaves some of the fringe parties and the independents.
No wonder the tories are smiling - they are set for ever sadly.
nosurprisestherethen, Wycombe says...
11:13am Fri 16 Oct 09
The advantage of the Lib Dems is they do have a looser hold on their councillors and allow them some independence in their views. If the choice is between Lib Dem and Conservative (which it is in Wycombe) then I know which party I would trust more to allow its members the freedom to truly represent their communities.
Save Wycombe, High Wycombe says...
12:25pm Fri 16 Oct 09
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
1:32pm Fri 16 Oct 09
demoness wrote:A powerful, pensive and perspective post , demoness. I tend to agree with all your points.
The trouble is, this council is no longer democratic - it is autocratic. This is because we have no strong opposition to oust them at the next election. They know it, we know it and therefore they can pretty much do and think as they like. I am sure that their attitude is that all this chuntering will die down and come the next election they will be back in.
And sadly they will be right. We need some good strong independent candidates who truly care about this town and are not alligned to a political party with an agenda.
I have made my feelings very clear on the motives of the lib dems. I do not know how anyone can say that Wassell is strong - she was labour, now she is lib dem. How do we know she might not change allegience again? In fact I bet she already has a party lined up.
As for the bloke who wants to be an MP and is also a councillor for Totteridge - well words fail me TBH. He is using Totteridge as a stepping stone to greater things. In the unlikely event of him becoming MP for Wycombe can we imagine him caring two hoots for Totteridge?
Now what about Labour? Sorry, do we have a labour party in this town? I have never seen any evidence.
That leaves some of the fringe parties and the independents.
No wonder the tories are smiling - they are set for ever sadly.
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Informative too. I particularly like the use of word ' chuntering' because that's all that seems to happen. I'm afraid that's what I tend to do. That's, as you say , why these ratbags get away with things
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Collectively we 'ordinary' folk need to be more active about issues we care about and not let these arrogant despicable so-and-sos walk all over us.
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Perhaps the worm can and is turning albeit slowly. Fingers crossed.
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Regards
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PS Have e-mailed our MP (PGOODMAN@parliament
.uk) about this subject , though I doubt it will have much effect as he is resigning. Although if hundreds of people did that (a short pithy message) it might have some influence. Particularly if the messages outnumber his other mail (if it you know what I mean).
demoness, Hades says...
1:37pm Fri 16 Oct 09
And as for lib dem's having more independence in their views - well they are allowed to at the moment. That would all change should they get to power.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
2:04pm Fri 16 Oct 09
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Even Ghengis Khan and the Golden Horde.
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
4:28pm Fri 16 Oct 09
Clarke and Green and the hardline Tories hate them as they refuse to back down on local issues that matter to local people.
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
4:28pm Fri 16 Oct 09
Clarke and Green and the hardline Tories hate them as they refuse to back down on local issues that matter to local people.
nannynanny, high wycombe says...
4:37pm Fri 16 Oct 09
Save Wycombe wrote:Afraid to speak out? Is WDC run as a democracy or a dictatorship? I urge the Conservative Councillors who support the pool to step forward now - make your voice heard, stick your hand up in the air and say you disagree. Please alter the legacy that your current leadership wishes to leave behind.
Lib Dems believe in localism, which mandates that their Councillors take into account the views of local people on local issues. Since it is quite clear that the vast majority of local people do not support the closure of Holywell Mead Pool, it is only to be expected that their Councillors would support this campaign. That said, they do permit their Councillors much more freedom than the Tories do. There are several Tory Councillors who support the pool - they are just afraid to speak out.
lidopraiser, pinions says...
2:17pm Sat 17 Oct 09
I am concerned that a narrow interest like bowling or climbing might load a consultation. There is nothing wrong with these pursuits but they should be catered for in their own right rather than at the expense of others.
This proposed consultation must be kept under close scrutiny eg its cost, how loaded the questions are and the scope. Will it be for Wycombe Town, East Wycombe or the District?
We will see!
yog, says...
2:26pm Sat 17 Oct 09
time to go clarke wrote:Absoultely right. The Lib Dems are the only ones who are speaking up for our Town.
we want councillors that care about our town and speak out on local issues seems Lib Dems do just that. Clarke and Green and the hardline Tories hate them as they refuse to back down on local issues that matter to local people.
The Conservatives pathetic attempts to hijack the pool meeting shows just how desperate they have become.
The meeting voted to include the pool in the future consultation of the site. If the Conservatives fail to do this they will be going against the stated wish of the local residents. Do that at your peril Cllr Clarke.
lidopraiser, pinions says...
2:49pm Sat 17 Oct 09
If there was a new leader there might be a more enlightened attitude to the pool issue.
time to go clarke, Wycombe says...
5:45pm Sat 17 Oct 09
lidopraiser wrote:Even if Clarke went there are more of a similar mind to take her place --Like Green, Bendish-Brown or other uncaring Tories who don't care about our town and are even more unsympathetic!!! Its in the make up of Tories -- remember Thatcher there are still Tories about locally just like her !!!!
I think Mrs Clarke will stand down yog. She has said she cannot stand for MP due to sexism and she has completed Eden which was one of her aims. She has withstood challenges to her leadership. The money she gets cannot be more than about 20k surely so that in itself might not make it worthwhile to continue. If there was a new leader there might be a more enlightened attitude to the pool issue.
J B Blackett, High Wycombe says...
7:43pm Sat 17 Oct 09
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It's not just the pool , or the burying in a conctrete pipe of the River Wye or the destruction of almhouses or old historic streets or the building of horrendous looking 'modern' unused office blocks or inappropriate rabbit-hutch flats designed and destined in a short time to be the slums of the future.
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It's the whole arrogant , uncaring undemocratic attitude of this current shower of despicable self-indulgent self-interest groups.
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Never mind tradition and all that self-preening weighing-in ceremony - lets have a Laying-Into ceremony where the population of Wycombe and District 'Lay Into' these Recalcitrant Useless Councillors and a Paying-In Ceremony when they pay us back for the stupid vandalisation there have caused to happen.
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What a shameful horrible lot we've got !
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Regards to all except WDC
Heated public meeting held over Holywell Mead
Heated public meeting held over Holywell Mead
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nannynanny, high wycombe says...
11:41pm Tue 13 Oct 09
Should it not have been the council that arranged, paid for, held and organised a public consultation back in March before they decided to close the pool on our behalf?