MP: burka ban 'just absurd' (From Bucks Free Press)
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Wycombe MP Steve Baker : burka ban 'just absurd'
4:42pm Saturday 24th July 2010 in News By James Nadal
CREATING a law to ban the burka would be “just absurd”, Wycombe MP Steve Baker says.
The wearing of the Islamic face veil has been the subject of a heated debate this week.
It follows Tory MP Philip Hollobone’s comments that he would not meet constituents wearing a burka unless the veil was lifted.
He put forward a private members bill which would make it illegal for people to cover their faces in public.
A recent YouGov poll of 2,205 voters found 67 per cent support a burka ban while French MPs last week voted to outlaw the wearing of full-face veils in public.
But Mr Baker said wearing the garment was about “modesty”.
He told the Free Press: “My view is that ladies should be able to wear whatever they wish within the bounds of decency, as indeed anyone should.
“I think if a lady wishes to cover her face in the interests of modesty she should be entitled to do so.
“One of the crazy things about this discussion is people are talking about using the law to compel ladies to be less modest. That’s the way I see it.”
He said: “It just isn’t a matter for the law. Imagine what we would be like if the law was saying your skirt was too long, it ought to be shorter, there would be uproar, it would be mad.
“It’s just absurd. Ladies who want to wear it should be allowed to wear it.”
He said: “As a personal subjective thing when I’m speaking to someone I like to see their face because we are all humans and I don’t think I’ve sinned by looking at a ladies face but I understand that other people have other views.”
Mr Baker said he would never turn a burka wearing constituent away.
“I think it’s a matter for each individual MP to decide but again I think the law should be silent on it.
“When a person comes to see an MP, bear in mind they’re only going to see their MP because they are at the end of their tether.
“So to add to their problems by saying they’ve got to be less modest, not for me, I wouldn’t do it.
“There’s a large Asian population and Muslim population in Wycombe and I’ve never had an lady come to see me who was not showing her face and I wouldn’t be offended if a lady did so.”
But he added nobody should be “compelled” to wear one either.
Mr Baker’s Tory colleague Immigration minister Damian Green has dismissed the idea of a ban, claiming it would be “rather un-British”.
Comments(38)
sidthesexist
says...
5:11pm Sat 24 Jul 10
iworld
says...
5:29pm Sat 24 Jul 10
J B Blackett
says...
5:40pm Sat 24 Jul 10
iworld wrote:A Nunn ? However I would not ban it either. We have had too many pathetic unworkable stupid pointless laws imposed on us from all the politicians in recent years. We ought to get rid of a lot more
Well done to our MP Steve Baker for exercising common sense here - I think we need to understand firstly - that Muslim women who choose to wear the Burka are doing it out of their own choice - as a Nunn who would out of her own choice. Furthermore the media hysteria on this topic is rather unfair and inflammatory - this is an attack of the freedom everyone enjoys - if people choose to cover themselves more than others - I don’t see that as a problem with this - they are not harming anyone
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That's laws and politicians , I mean .if you don't mind. They are the reasons the police are ineffective , paper-worked over-loaded , target-obsessed and alienated from the public.
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If you had to choose a group of people to develop sensible laws for ordinary folk in this country , why would you choose politicians ? They make a mess of everything , IMO - history proves it - especially the self-serving ones (you know the ones I mean)
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But that's only my opinion of course.
maharaja47
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5:56pm Sat 24 Jul 10
NHS Bucks is holding its AGM next Tuesday, open to members of the public. I intend going but I wonder if he, or his representative will be?
ConcernedofLoughton
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6:47pm Sat 24 Jul 10
Slacker
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7:15pm Sat 24 Jul 10
ConcernedofLoughton wrote:I agree. What someone wears is of no consequence to me, but I feel that if someone comes into our shop wearing one, we should have the right to ask them to remove it for CCTV purposes - just as we might if someone is wearing a crash helmet or hoodie.
It doesnt bother me as long as they are prepared to remove the headdress when entering banks, petrol stations and verifying photo ID. Unfortunately this isnt what they are prepared to do.
J B Blackett
says...
7:15pm Sat 24 Jul 10
ConcernedofLoughton wrote:Have you asked them ?
It doesnt bother me as long as they are prepared to remove the headdress when entering banks, petrol stations and verifying photo ID. Unfortunately this isnt what they are prepared to do.
yog
says...
7:23pm Sat 24 Jul 10
The big question is whether they are wearing it out of their free will or they are under pressure to conform by male family members.
If it's their free choice then no problem.
J B Blackett
says...
7:24pm Sat 24 Jul 10
Slacker wrote:What if when they removed the burka you found they were wearing a crash helmet ?
ConcernedofLoughton wrote:I agree. What someone wears is of no consequence to me, but I feel that if someone comes into our shop wearing one, we should have the right to ask them to remove it for CCTV purposes - just as we might if someone is wearing a crash helmet or hoodie.
It doesnt bother me as long as they are prepared to remove the headdress when entering banks, petrol stations and verifying photo ID. Unfortunately this isnt what they are prepared to do.
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And when they removed that , you found out they were wearing a hoodie ?
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And when they removed that , you found out they were wearing a balaclava ?
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And when they removed that , you found out they were wearing a a mask ?
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Etc etc - you could end up with just a pile of second-hand clothing and nobody in sight anywhere.
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Anyway what sort of person would want to go out dressed like that , in all that clobber ? Actually and unfortunately I do know someone like that.
Slacker
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7:28pm Sat 24 Jul 10
J B Blackett
says...
7:29pm Sat 24 Jul 10
yog wrote:In that case - go up to any woman in the street (preferably one bigger than you) and ask her if it was her husband who made her wear those over-tight jeans / shorts etc which made some parts of the body bulge just a bit.
Of course it is absurd.
The big question is whether they are wearing it out of their free will or they are under pressure to conform by male family members.
If it's their free choice then no problem.
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Then wait for the answer , which will eventually come your way.
Doom
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11:04pm Sat 24 Jul 10
and.
Slacker
says...
11:34pm Sat 24 Jul 10
Doom wrote:You mean... just like a Jawa in Star Wars?
what if they removed it and underneath was.........nothing. staring into an infinate void. swirling colours draw your eyes into the space where a face should be, your whole being drawn in, you find yourself floating within a dimension that has no heft........ as you look, stars appear, you expand, dissipate, find peace........underst
and.
J B Blackett
says...
11:45pm Sat 24 Jul 10
Doom wrote:No, I think he means like a visit to the dentist when you get an anesthetic and you go under. I think.
what if they removed it and underneath was.........nothing. staring into an infinate void. swirling colours draw your eyes into the space where a face should be, your whole being drawn in, you find yourself floating within a dimension that has no heft........ as you look, stars appear, you expand, dissipate, find peace........underst
and.
sticksandstones
says...
12:07pm Sun 25 Jul 10
le. Description.........
.. even a security camera would be of no use. Rules are made for the minority as always in " Diverse Britain", and when they do not succeed then the court of European Human Rights step in.
Maybe we should all visit our politicians wearing hoodies,cycle helmets, balaclavas and whatever takes our fancy to cover up our faces. Then we can all quote that it is no different to a Burka.
Lets hope the 82% against the wearing of the Berka vote when the time comes to boot Steve Baker out.
678
says...
1:04pm Sun 25 Jul 10
Plus ça change...
says...
2:04pm Sun 25 Jul 10
You can never judge a book by its cover.
J B Blackett
says...
6:27pm Sun 25 Jul 10
Plus ça change... wrote:Can bemused burghers buy (or barter) a bargain basement book on bicycles buttoned-up within a black, blue or beige burka ?
Respect and tolerance should work both ways.
You can never judge a book by its cover.
sidthesexist
says...
7:02pm Sun 25 Jul 10
sticksandstones wrote:It already has happened. One of the bombers from the second attempt to attack London escaped by wearing one of these and hiding his identity
So what happens when the first serious crime is commited by someone wearing one of those Burkas. Who is underneath it? Male/Female/paedophi
le. Description.........
.. even a security camera would be of no use. Rules are made for the minority as always in " Diverse Britain", and when they do not succeed then the court of European Human Rights step in.
Maybe we should all visit our politicians wearing hoodies,cycle helmets, balaclavas and whatever takes our fancy to cover up our faces. Then we can all quote that it is no different to a Burka.
Lets hope the 82% against the wearing of the Berka vote when the time comes to boot Steve Baker out.
Gailxx
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7:26pm Sun 25 Jul 10
I agree with '678' cos we wouldn't be able to please ourselves in other countries etc. we would have to respect the countries laws etc!!
rushma
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8:42pm Sun 25 Jul 10
Where it becomes necessary to show the face, e.g. for medicine, the lady, I understand, would only go for purchases where a female assistant, or proprietor, is in attendant.
rushma
says...
8:45pm Sun 25 Jul 10
Gailxx wrote:Gailxx, it is NOT against the law to wear a burka in the UK.
personally I hate seeing my 4 year old Granddaughters terrified face and the way she tries to hide as close as she can to me and my daughter, when she sees one coming towards her!!!
I agree with '678' cos we wouldn't be able to please ourselves in other countries etc. we would have to respect the countries laws etc!!
tigeran
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9:19pm Sun 25 Jul 10
guesswork
says...
9:33pm Sun 25 Jul 10
salena
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12:24am Mon 26 Jul 10
Gailxx wrote:why is your grandaughter terrified u need to teach your kids to respect other religions and cultures i have 3 kids when where out and about they see half naked women with there boobs out and wearing next to nothing u dont see me going on about banning vulgar clothing again its a persons choice i teach my kids tolarance towards ppl and religions try it sometime
personally I hate seeing my 4 year old Granddaughters terrified face and the way she tries to hide as close as she can to me and my daughter, when she sees one coming towards her!!! I agree with '678' cos we wouldn't be able to please ourselves in other countries etc. we would have to respect the countries laws etc!!
Ummm
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2:05am Mon 26 Jul 10
Last point its about modesty.. Every women is considerd 2b a precious diamond, would u be protectiv and keep it hidden so only u may admire its beauty, or boast off and tempt otherz 2 nick it from u..?
Clown4fun.co.uk
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9:25am Mon 26 Jul 10
Eris
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9:50am Mon 26 Jul 10
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Men do not own women, sorry to break that to you. If my other half told me he wanted me to completely cover up in case some other man 'nicked' me from him, I would be peeved; a) it implies ownership; our relationship is a two way street, and b) it shows a massive lack of trust that I would allow myself to be 'nicked'.
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As for your first comment, if it is not a woman's choice to wear a burkha, I fail to see how it is for her benefit. it is just men forcing their insecurities and prejudices onto women.
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I didn't exactly understand the rest of your comment, so I am unable to respond to it.
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My own personal opinion is just that; if a woman chooses to wear a burkha, ok. Although I do think it shows a little arrogance; 'I am so gorgeous that if I reveal my face all men will want me and I will be in a pickle'. 99.9% of women manage to wander round without inspiring riots in the streets or strange men gawping at them. Unless all women wearing burkhas are in fact Helen of Sparta reincarnated, I don't think they have too much to worry about.
tigeran
says...
11:52am Mon 26 Jul 10
Eris wrote:You will probably find a lot of them do it just because they can in an enviroment which mostly takes offense to them wearing it. It is novel for them to be able to be allowed to do something that offends most of the population and get away with it due to the fact that in their own country a similar act of 'defiance' would result in decapitation, stoning, burning etc etc due to the neandertholic and barbaric culture they have over there. our own 'liberal' way of life over here will always be abused by these type of primitive cultures.
Ummm, in all honesty, I find your comments a little offensive (once I mananged to decipher them). . Men do not own women, sorry to break that to you. If my other half told me he wanted me to completely cover up in case some other man 'nicked' me from him, I would be peeved; a) it implies ownership; our relationship is a two way street, and b) it shows a massive lack of trust that I would allow myself to be 'nicked'. . As for your first comment, if it is not a woman's choice to wear a burkha, I fail to see how it is for her benefit. it is just men forcing their insecurities and prejudices onto women. . I didn't exactly understand the rest of your comment, so I am unable to respond to it. . My own personal opinion is just that; if a woman chooses to wear a burkha, ok. Although I do think it shows a little arrogance; 'I am so gorgeous that if I reveal my face all men will want me and I will be in a pickle'. 99.9% of women manage to wander round without inspiring riots in the streets or strange men gawping at them. Unless all women wearing burkhas are in fact Helen of Sparta reincarnated, I don't think they have too much to worry about.
J B Blackett
says...
12:50pm Mon 26 Jul 10
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There seems to me to be an awful lot of them around nowadays and they deliberately go around offending ordinary folk , usually by passing useless stupid illogical laws and THEN saying 'It's for your own good ; I'm am a superior person and more qualified than you to say stupid things. Do as I say, not as I do'
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Berks the lot of them. And Horrible With It ! On a par with Dangerous Dogs.
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Please forget about the 'burqa' ( note the spelling) . It's becoming very wearing - -- sorry just a little joke , folks.
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No offence.
Ummm
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4:49pm Mon 26 Jul 10
Ummm
says...
4:50pm Mon 26 Jul 10
J B Blackett
says...
5:33pm Mon 26 Jul 10
Did I miss something ? Is there now a huge literacy gap opening up between people ?
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It put's the whole burqa thing into perspective , IMO ?
bakerbill
says...
7:17pm Mon 26 Jul 10
demoness
says...
9:04pm Mon 26 Jul 10
Ummm wrote:Whatever happened to literacy is my next question?
Every1 to there own opinion.. Personally i reckon it shudn b banned.. whateva happend 2 being liberated..
Tell me, do you think you look cool and happening writing in this fashion?
You don't - it just looks silly and takes away any credence in your opinion.
J B Blackett
says...
9:40pm Mon 26 Jul 10
bakerbill wrote:Should it be "Wycombe MP Steve Berk", please ? - see my cutting remark above.
The large numbers of Muslim voters in this town is probably the reason High Wycombe MP Steve Baker likes the burka .
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Or do you think it should have been the actor / director Steve Berkoff as the Wycombe MP and the Conservative Party made a terrible slip up and decision in the selection process ?
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Let's all invade the street outside the Conservative HQ on the A40 and shout in unison and rhythmically " Berk Off , Berk Off , Berk Off ....." for hours on end.
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Perhaps eventually these politicos will get the people's message.
greavsey
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10:26am Tue 27 Jul 10
erm says...
5:06pm Sat 24 Jul 10