Residents asked to leave meeting after row breaks out (From Bucks Free Press)

By "Chair" i suppose Pushman means Chairman!! I'm not sure why this man insists that residents "respect the Chairman". Respect goes both ways and it starts with earning it rather than demanding it. The Chairman clearly closed the meeting for questions so quite why she is now throwing her toys out of the pram is beypnd me. Perphaps a new Chairman who can control the meeting and meet the public's expectations is whatis really needed.

None of this sounds very democratic.
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Clearly people want to say things but they are being gagged.

Oh dear, oh dear. Another Hughenden Parish Council meeting, another utter debacle, comically chaired.
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And all in front of the Chairman of WDC.
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Will anybody save these poor 'majority' Councillors from their own Pride and Prejudices?
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Sounds like only Cllrs Smith and Konieczny have the courage.

What a bunch of clowns! What good do they do and why do they think they are so special? The thought that tax payers money is wasted on these idiots peeves me.

If this had been a report of a government meeting taking place in the former Soviet Union, we would be outraged at the treatment of the citizens, and their inability to question the "leaders".
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This is more like a dictatorship.
Is it right that councillors were threatening to use the police against the public? The public only wanted to raise some very valid questions, or illicit answers to previously raised questions that had been ignored by the councillors.
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These councillors should realise that they work for us. They do not rule us!
Bring back democracy and let the people be heard.

If it hadn't been so serious it would have made a great pantomime show complete with Mr Punch the policeman.

HPC bar 2 have become a laughing stock and a disgrace to the office they hold

In my opinion Councillor Pushman is well past his 'sell by' date and should depart followed by the majority of the useless council.

We won't be gagged and we will carry on using our democratic rights until the PC resign, the Shapps proposal becomes law or 5 May whichever comes first.

Thank you Cllrs Smith and Konieczny. You keep our faith in all that is honest and good.

Pompous petty pathetic puerile pitiful parish prats would not be too powerful a phrase.

J B Blackett wrote:
Pompous petty pathetic puerile pitiful parish prats would not be too powerful a phrase.

Maybe not too powerful, but certainly too costly. They aint worth 7p.

The games that little children play .....

Affordable housing in Nimby Valley.
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One sure way for sparks to fly.
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But will it happen?
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What a pity passions aren't raised when more important issues appear on the County and District Council agendas.

M40 wrote:
Affordable housing in Nimby Valley.
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One sure way for sparks to fly.
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But will it happen?
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What a pity passions aren't raised when more important issues appear on the County and District Council agendas.

Nothing wrong with wanting to preserve a piece of the countryside.
Nothing wrong with wanting to protect your way of life.
Hell if someone wanted to build houses on an AONB near me I would be nimby of the year!
I notice it is always people who are not affected who throw the nimby argument out there.

demoness wrote:

M40 wrote: Affordable housing in Nimby Valley. - One sure way for sparks to fly. - But will it happen? - What a pity passions aren't raised when more important issues appear on the County and District Council agendas.

Nothing wrong with wanting to preserve a piece of the countryside. Nothing wrong with wanting to protect your way of life. Hell if someone wanted to build houses on an AONB near me I would be nimby of the year! I notice it is always people who are not affected who throw the nimby argument out there.

You are missing the point,

It isn't a battle over affordable houses, Its a fight to protect Green Belt land. Not just for us but for our children and their children

That land has been there since time began and should be left that way.

Its one of the few free things we have left to enjoy.

Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

Gabriolan wrote:
Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

So you think its OK for people to lose their homes and for lovely old listed buildings to be demolished not to mention great swathes of the Green Belt which would be lost?

For your information we are also supporting people who are on the preferred route.

We are aware that Hughenden could become the chosen route and we will also fight that with the support of our MP.

Obviously none of this affects you otherwise you would not be making such inane comments

Don't worry - the current HS2 rail scheme will not happen in the way projected by our stupid , useless politicians supported and sponsored by lots of greedy devious self-interested financiers.
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These are the same people who have created (and continue to create) the financial , population , political and energy mess we are in at the moment.
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You are right to oppose them but they have their own internal self-destructive forces already at work. It only needs a little well-timed push to topple and stop them usually.

Typical Hughenden Parish Council...

"They never fail to disappoint."

The HPC meetings are going from bad to worse. It is about time that someone admitted to themselves that it is now becoming impossible to conduct proper council business whist there is such a massive level of disapproval and no confidence in many of the councillors. Just look at the number of recent complaints to the WDC Standards committee. They are even complaining about each other now!

Next pistols at dawn no doubt?

Clearly this Parish council is untenable under it's current leadership. I'm supprised they think they can carry on.
Do the decent thing and resign. But would anyone want their positions???

Bring it on Gabriolan
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I make no apology for defending my family's immediate environment, especially when that's against things that nobody needs. No-one from further afield is going to do it with any passion - that's human nature.
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People choose to live in AONB Green Belt areas (whether they were born there or not), and make sacrifices to do so. We don't just end up there by accident or indifference. Is it any surprise we take issue with our own Parish Council for completely ignoring this fact in pursuit of there own glorification?
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If you don't care at all about your immediate environment, then I'm sure WDC and BCC be more than happy to stack your neighbourhood high with cheek-by-jowl housing, railways, rubbish tips, traveller sites, rehab centres, open prisons and paedophile shelters. They need to go somewhere right, so why not right next to those people who aren't NIMBYS - like you?
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Just tell us your precise address and it shall be done.

Dear Hughenden Parish Council,

"You are spending my money - badly."

"Without asking me what I think, you are making decisions that you think are best for me, but they are not."

"You are making a complete laughing stock of yourselves yet I need you to be taken seriously as the job you should be doing is important to me."

I am disappointed and annoyed!

Frankly, it is like watching a slow motion train crash with the engine driver blinded by ambition and self-righteousness. After the crash we will see nothing but bits of human debris littering the landscape in the form of ruined reputations and destroyed self-respect. And then we will be able to see who saw it coming and threw themselves off the train in an attempt to save themselves.

Ewartwhatyoubulldoze - are you suggesting that Gabriolan should state precisely where he/she lives? Is that a bit like you should stop hiding behing a pretend name of the Chairman of HPC and state EXACTLY who you are?
Pot, kettle, black, come to mind.

Ewartwhatyoubulldoze wrote:
Bring it on Gabriolan - I make no apology for defending my family's immediate environment, especially when that's against things that nobody needs. No-one from further afield is going to do it with any passion - that's human nature. - People choose to live in AONB Green Belt areas (whether they were born there or not), and make sacrifices to do so. We don't just end up there by accident or indifference. Is it any surprise we take issue with our own Parish Council for completely ignoring this fact in pursuit of there own glorification? - If you don't care at all about your immediate environment, then I'm sure WDC and BCC be more than happy to stack your neighbourhood high with cheek-by-jowl housing, railways, rubbish tips, traveller sites, rehab centres, open prisons and paedophile shelters. They need to go somewhere right, so why not right next to those people who aren't NIMBYS - like you? - Just tell us your precise address and it shall be done.

So Ewartwhatyoubulldoze other than lots of words what is your imput to maintaining the Chilterns?

JWilks62, I don't think HPC are in any doubt who I am, and clearly I have no real interest in where Gabriolan lives. Try not to see the world in such literal terms.
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efbog, I am a member of the Chilterns Society. I am actively fighting inappropriate development of our AONB and destruction of it by HS2 - with a lot more than just words on this website.
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Clearly there's more I could be doing given more time, but if you were hoping to make me feel guilty about not clearing ditches, fixing footpaths and doing meals on wheels at weekends I'm afraid you have failed.
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I assume your contribution is much longer and has more girth than mine.
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I am already anticipating a bout of contribution envy from your next post...

efbog wrote:

Ewartwhatyoubulldoze wrote: Bring it on Gabriolan - I make no apology for defending my family's immediate environment, especially when that's against things that nobody needs. No-one from further afield is going to do it with any passion - that's human nature. - People choose to live in AONB Green Belt areas (whether they were born there or not), and make sacrifices to do so. We don't just end up there by accident or indifference. Is it any surprise we take issue with our own Parish Council for completely ignoring this fact in pursuit of there own glorification? - If you don't care at all about your immediate environment, then I'm sure WDC and BCC be more than happy to stack your neighbourhood high with cheek-by-jowl housing, railways, rubbish tips, traveller sites, rehab centres, open prisons and paedophile shelters. They need to go somewhere right, so why not right next to those people who aren't NIMBYS - like you? - Just tell us your precise address and it shall be done.

So Ewartwhatyoubulldoze other than lots of words what is your imput to maintaining the Chilterns?

Apart from lots of fine words Ewartwhatyoubulldoze fights harder than most to protect the Chilterns' environment. Not only the so called affordable housing but also HS2. How many of you have a full time job, are caring parents and still find time to care enough to fight?

ewartwhatyoubuldoze
Good for you.

Turnerblindeye wrote:

Gabriolan wrote: Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

So you think its OK for people to lose their homes and for lovely old listed buildings to be demolished not to mention great swathes of the Green Belt which would be lost? For your information we are also supporting people who are on the preferred route. We are aware that Hughenden could become the chosen route and we will also fight that with the support of our MP. Obviously none of this affects you otherwise you would not be making such inane comments

Sometimes it takes an inane comment to remind people what really is important - and put into perspective what really isn't.

It worked. Job done.

Gabriolan wrote:

Turnerblindeye wrote:

Gabriolan wrote: Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

So you think its OK for people to lose their homes and for lovely old listed buildings to be demolished not to mention great swathes of the Green Belt which would be lost? For your information we are also supporting people who are on the preferred route. We are aware that Hughenden could become the chosen route and we will also fight that with the support of our MP. Obviously none of this affects you otherwise you would not be making such inane comments

Sometimes it takes an inane comment to remind people what really is important - and put into perspective what really isn't.

It worked. Job done.

And my remark spurred Gabriolan into making the above remark. And Gabriolan remarks made Ewartwhatyoubulldoze make those subsequent remarks.. And the eEwartwhatyoubulldoz
e remarks made .........etc etc.
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What I really want know is - who is it who is pulling all our strings ?
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I hope it's not that petty pompous Pushyman character ! What an awful scenario to contemplate.

Cllr Pushman doesn't really have a remit in this context.
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It would be nice to think he could restore harmony by coaxing HPC back across the lines they have already crossed.
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Unfortunately he seem more intent on pointing out to Parishioners that HPC can, technically, do whatever they want in between elections. Apparently we should all just sit there quietly, grin and bear it.

J B Blackett wrote:

Gabriolan wrote:

Turnerblindeye wrote:

Gabriolan wrote: Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

So you think its OK for people to lose their homes and for lovely old listed buildings to be demolished not to mention great swathes of the Green Belt which would be lost? For your information we are also supporting people who are on the preferred route. We are aware that Hughenden could become the chosen route and we will also fight that with the support of our MP. Obviously none of this affects you otherwise you would not be making such inane comments

Sometimes it takes an inane comment to remind people what really is important - and put into perspective what really isn't. It worked. Job done.

And my remark spurred Gabriolan into making the above remark. And Gabriolan remarks made Ewartwhatyoubulldoze make those subsequent remarks.. And the eEwartwhatyoubulldoz e remarks made .........etc etc. . What I really want know is - who is it who is pulling all our strings ? . I hope it's not that petty pompous Pushyman character ! What an awful scenario to contemplate.

Can't be Pushyman. He only appears for photo shoots of himself.

Turnerblindeye wrote:

J B Blackett wrote:

Gabriolan wrote:

Turnerblindeye wrote:

Gabriolan wrote: Maybe the government should adopt the alternative HS2 route through Hughenden Valley - that'd give'em something meaningful to argue about!

So you think its OK for people to lose their homes and for lovely old listed buildings to be demolished not to mention great swathes of the Green Belt which would be lost? For your information we are also supporting people who are on the preferred route. We are aware that Hughenden could become the chosen route and we will also fight that with the support of our MP. Obviously none of this affects you otherwise you would not be making such inane comments

Sometimes it takes an inane comment to remind people what really is important - and put into perspective what really isn't. It worked. Job done.

And my remark spurred Gabriolan into making the above remark. And Gabriolan remarks made Ewartwhatyoubulldoze make those subsequent remarks.. And the eEwartwhatyoubulldoz e remarks made .........etc etc. . What I really want know is - who is it who is pulling all our strings ? . I hope it's not that petty pompous Pushyman character ! What an awful scenario to contemplate.

Can't be Pushyman. He only appears for photo shoots of himself.

Shooting him would seem very appropriate from most of the opinions and information displayed.
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As a non-resident of 'The Valley' but with a profound affection of and interest in the Chilterns , I am a concerned observer.
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I wish I could get involved / deal with these apparent (alleged) petty tyrants. Oh, yes !

Peggy Ewart should resign, not next May, but now. She does not have popular support and disregards the concerns of local people. She therefore serves no further useful purpose and a new chair should be found.

Earlier in the year, a letter from the tories was delivered to my house. You may recall it, in it they claimed that they would protect the local area, areas of ANOB and greenbelt. So why do our tory councillors sit by and allow HPC to continue with their plans to destoy ANOB and green belt, do they wish to be relieved of their duties to?

Minority Report wrote:
Earlier in the year, a letter from the tories was delivered to my house. You may recall it, in it they claimed that they would protect the local area, areas of ANOB and greenbelt. So why do our tory councillors sit by and allow HPC to continue with their plans to destoy ANOB and green belt, do they wish to be relieved of their duties to?

That letter was in direct response to our complaints about the behaviour of HPC and was a request to our District Councillors to try and defuse the situation.
The waffle they wrote totally ignored our complaints but was an opportunity to give themselves a pat on the back for doing such a good job.
We have one good District Councillor. Pushman will stand down in May and the other one will lose his seat on WDC along with the majority of HPC.

Greenbelt is wonderful in theory but has rapidly become a hindrance. While our population increases, while we have fewer people living in each house, while we don't improve our infrastructure to support ease of travelling...we have to reassess what outdated preservations we have put on land. The land that your house is built on is equally impacted by ythe houses that are built there now is it not?

Should we not be reassessing why we have a need for more housing in the first place?

As for saving greenbelt for our children, is it saving the land for the priviledged few worth continuing to keep the unpriviledged majority in dire straits.

I know children who have never walked on grass, who do not understand that an object looks smaller further away because they don't understand perspective having never seen past the end of their street or their school yard.

We have a beautiful world, and we should be looking to share what we have, faithfully to the surroundings, and of course sustainably. But does our current socal and economic situation not warrant re-assessing the untouchable nature of the finite resource we have on this small, and ever more crowded island?

I was born and brought up in Industrial Birmingham in the 1950s and our playground was the street outside. The nearest green park was a bus ride away and our Victorian school had concrete for a playground.
Strangely enough I never felt underprivileged and what we have now is due to hard work and sacrifice

Our son at age 7 had an accident to his eye and we were in Moorfields Eye Hospital for 4 weeks. He lost most of the sight in one eye. There was a small boy in the next bed who had just had an eye removed because it was malignant and without removal Paul would have died. That child came from the worst part of the East End but there was no self pity. Quite the contrary. He was going to grow up and become a doctor. A salutary lesson for all who feel life owes them something.

Wycombe District does have housing both for people who want to buy and for social housing. A look in the BFP property pages will show many good deals for youg people starting on the property ladder.

There is a park in Wooburn. We lived near it for many years and our son has many happy memories of that time.

May I suggest that if the children you refer to have never seen grass, a short walk will bring them to the park with a play area for the tinies and a woodland area for the older ones to explore.

The park and woodlands around Hughenden Manor are wonderful for children and are free. We have so many place like this to enjoy without spoiling our Green Belt.

Turnerblindeye wrote:
I was born and brought up in Industrial Birmingham in the 1950s and our playground was the street outside. The nearest green park was a bus ride away and our Victorian school had concrete for a playground. Strangely enough I never felt underprivileged and what we have now is due to hard work and sacrifice Our son at age 7 had an accident to his eye and we were in Moorfields Eye Hospital for 4 weeks. He lost most of the sight in one eye. There was a small boy in the next bed who had just had an eye removed because it was malignant and without removal Paul would have died. That child came from the worst part of the East End but there was no self pity. Quite the contrary. He was going to grow up and become a doctor. A salutary lesson for all who feel life owes them something. Wycombe District does have housing both for people who want to buy and for social housing. A look in the BFP property pages will show many good deals for youg people starting on the property ladder. There is a park in Wooburn. We lived near it for many years and our son has many happy memories of that time. May I suggest that if the children you refer to have never seen grass, a short walk will bring them to the park with a play area for the tinies and a woodland area for the older ones to explore. The park and woodlands around Hughenden Manor are wonderful for children and are free. We have so many place like this to enjoy without spoiling our Green Belt.

I should have been clearer about separating the two isses and hopefully I didn't imply any charachter in my illustration feels any measure of self pity.

I grew up in Hughenden Parish, and value the landscape highly. I have campaigned myself about protecting the AONB where non-sensical development has been proposed.

And I believe Greenbelt is a righteous notion, but an unsustainable one where population continues to increase and the poverty gap widens.

There clearly isn't enough affordable housing in Wycombe regardless of what is in the papers. The brownfield sites are rapidly filling and running out (Wycombe Marsh development benig a current example). We could continue the urban sprawl or we could delicately and sustainably offer more variety.

Every new development over 25 homes must now provide 30% bedspace for affordable houses. Kingshaill Grange (formerly Wellesbourne Campus) has 80. Milton Place (formerly Terriers first) has 18.

Both are close to shops, buses etc, whereas the proposed site in Hughenden gets 2 buses a week and our shop is a Portakabin in the village hall grounds with temporary planning permission.

In my opinion HPC and the housing association are giving an inaccurate message. Affordable homes for village people? The reality is that no-one can buy their homes outright and on top of the share they buy there is an additional rental payment on the share still owned by the housing association. Add this to the mortgage and it becomes more expensive than buying outright from a private developer. The only winners are the housing association.
The housing association are by their own definition 'Social housing providers' and a large proportion are for rental only Not the way for people to get on the property ladder

I believe this is a 'vanity project' on behalf of the majority of HPC. A blue plaque on the wall and the Chairman's photograph in the press at the opening.

There is brownfield land in the Parish and no-one would object to building there. Put 10 houses on the Green Belt and the floodgates will be opened to private development

A final thouhgt. We have a frail 90+ widow living up the road. She is housebound and spends her days looking out across the fields. Who are we to take away the one pleasure in her life?

Turnerblindeye - if you know if all these other available sites, why don't you put them forward. We all know that HPC have asked the residents for their thoughts in this matter - why don't you assist?

Turnerblindeye wrote:
Every new development over 25 homes must now provide 30% bedspace for affordable houses. Kingshaill Grange (formerly Wellesbourne Campus) has 80. Milton Place (formerly Terriers first) has 18. Both are close to shops, buses etc, whereas the proposed site in Hughenden gets 2 buses a week and our shop is a Portakabin in the village hall grounds with temporary planning permission. In my opinion HPC and the housing association are giving an inaccurate message. Affordable homes for village people? The reality is that no-one can buy their homes outright and on top of the share they buy there is an additional rental payment on the share still owned by the housing association. Add this to the mortgage and it becomes more expensive than buying outright from a private developer. The only winners are the housing association. The housing association are by their own definition 'Social housing providers' and a large proportion are for rental only Not the way for people to get on the property ladder I believe this is a 'vanity project' on behalf of the majority of HPC. A blue plaque on the wall and the Chairman's photograph in the press at the opening. There is brownfield land in the Parish and no-one would object to building there. Put 10 houses on the Green Belt and the floodgates will be opened to private development A final thouhgt. We have a frail 90+ widow living up the road. She is housebound and spends her days looking out across the fields. Who are we to take away the one pleasure in her life?

The facilities available to any area being developed may well improve. Surely facilities are dictated by demand.

As a rentor, single woman, full time employee on not an immoderate wage for the area, getting a mortgage at the moment is still, regretably near to impossible. In the short term, cheaper rental units are invaluable to allow people to be housed and save at the same time. There are a variety of people out there needing a variety of houses. Increasing real social housing will release those higher value houses being used to home those who cannot afford them.

I would be interested to see if the precedent really has been set elsewhere in similar places, where agreement for one small development has led to a influx of others. My understanding is the proposed changes in planning law would actually make that more difficult.

I have sympathy for your elderly neighbour; in a community as close as most of Hughenden it is lovely to see such care for all the members. However, and I have had troubel phrasing this without seeming brutal or lacking in compassion, but we have to look to the future, short and long term, and cannot make decisions based on who happens to live in a house on a particular date. Just as a company going through a restructure has to address the needs of its staff welfare, it needs to think about the business. Does the company think about the people who happen to be in post now, or change their structure to reflect what will best support forward improvements?

JWilks62 wrote:
Turnerblindeye - if you know if all these other available sites, why don't you put them forward. We all know that HPC have asked the residents for their thoughts in this matter - why don't you assist?

You must be very close to the Clerk/Chairman to know whether I have or haven't.

Turnerblindeye - I did not say whether you had or had not let HPC know your suggestions - I merely suggested you could. With regard to the implication - I'm not, nor have ever been connected to HPC - actually I thought you were the Clerk - with the name tag and all? Or is it that you are trying to cast aspersions on her, as with Ewartwhatyoubulldoze
?

JWilks62 wrote:
Turnerblindeye - I did not say whether you had or had not let HPC know your suggestions - I merely suggested you could. With regard to the implication - I'm not, nor have ever been connected to HPC - actually I thought you were the Clerk - with the name tag and all? Or is it that you are trying to cast aspersions on her, as with Ewartwhatyoubulldoze

?

Let he or she without aspersions cast the first one.

JWilks62 wrote:
Turnerblindeye - I did not say whether you had or had not let HPC know your suggestions - I merely suggested you could. With regard to the implication - I'm not, nor have ever been connected to HPC - actually I thought you were the Clerk - with the name tag and all? Or is it that you are trying to cast aspersions on her, as with Ewartwhatyoubulldoze ?

I am not the Clerk nor do I aspire to be.

I have no need to cast aspersions on the Clerk. She is perfectly able to do that for herself. However, if my user name offends you I am perfectly happy to change it.

After the recent debacles called council meetings, and depite promised to the contrary, Hughenden Parish Council have now issued a very selective and biased questionnaire to parishoners on the issue of "Rural Affordable Housing".

It asks if family members would return if rural "affordable" housing was available, without defining what affordable is. Of course anyone would if affordable meant well below market price (which it doesn't).

Having enticed an interest, the next question then asks if there is support for a small development .... to meet the "needs" of "local" people. This is like asking whether a child likes ice-cream. Here wishes are now confused with needs. And what constitutes a "need": a desire to live in beautiful surroundings; a wish to move closer to family; a need to take up a local job? Maybe the last, but with little employment in the parish, very few would fall into this category.

But if you have already moved out of the village, you are not a local. And what is local anyway? The current RAH development at Terriers is more local to many in the parish than is the present proposed site.

So having fired up the respondant to think about nearby cheap housing, where could these be built? Well, as there are no obvious building plots around, the next question asks whether they could pinch a little bit of farmland from the Green Belt. After all it says, there maybe no alternative but to do this!

At a recent parish council meeting, I was specifically assured that the questionnare would be compiled by an independant and professional body (I suggested one of the pollster companies). so who do the PC use? Only an offshoot of the English Rural Housing Association - the commercial body that stand to profit out of these schemes.

So much for local democracy.