Light pollution: Astronomer Paul Millington believes darker skies would be better but safety is also important
RURAL campaigners have backed a council decision to switch off street lights to save money - as Buckinghamshire is revealed as one of the worst areas for light pollution.
About 300 lights are set to be turned off in a trial scheme across the region from April, which could save the council £15,000 a year in energy costs.
The Campaign to Protect Rural England claims street lighting has caused light pollution - and adds a major problem is lights facing upwards which distort the visibility of the sky.
The county came fourth in the worst areas for light pollution in a CPRE study of ten areas across the South East.
The review was measured on how much light shined upwards compared to facing the ground.
Peter Cleasby, 57, chairman of CPRE, said: "We would be in favour of getting rid of unnecessary lighting which prevents people from seeing the sky clearly.
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"This sounds well worth doing but it is only part of the problem.
"It is a good start.
"There is no evidence that excessive lighting reduces crime."
The trial will target areas including the A4128 from the Wycombe town boundary up to the Cryers Hill Road roundabout and the A413 Aylesbury Road/Mobwell junction in Great Missenden. It will also affect the A40 - 250 metres west of Gerrards Cross, the A412 Denham Road, the Nashlee roundabout and A421 Radclive roundabout, both in Aylesbury.
Ian McGowan, a member of Buckinghamshire County Council's casualty reduction group, said measures such as intelligent road studs, were introduced in June 2006 to make the A4128 Hughenden Road safer.
Before then the road was averaging six crashes a year. In the last eight months there have been two.
“There is no evidence that excessive lighting reduces crime.”
Peter Cleasby
He said: "In terms of the effectiveness of the lighting, particularly with the trees there, the lighting is hampered by the trees and we feel that the use of intelligent road studs will delineate the carriageway to drivers far better.
"Even by turning the lights out people will be able to see the road very well and drive safer, as long as everything else they're doing is correct."
Mr McGowan added 96 per cent of all crashes involved human error and 77 per cent were solely due to this.
Between January 2001 and December 31, 2004 there have been two fatal, six serious and 32 slight collisions on the Hughenden Road.
Paul Millington, chairman of Wycombe Astronomical Society, said: "Obviously darker skies would be better but you have got to consider safety.
"From an astronomical point of view, brilliant, but on the other hand you have got to look at it safety wise.
"In some areas you can look up and see the Milky Way. In Wycombe you would never see that because of the light pollution, and basically that is caused because a lot of the light goes up instead of down."
In the Penn area some of the streets do not have lighting.
Tony Anderson, 60, of Hillcroft Road, said: "I've lived here for 30 years and have just got used to not having street lighting.
"I do not think lighting makes any difference to crime or accidents.
"I am happy with it and do not think it's an issue."
But Jean Smith, 60, of The Greenway, said: "The pavements are uneven and it is very dangerous. I push my grandson Harvey in a pram and it is hard to see the curb in the dark.
"Pedestrians have a problem with the darkness unlike drivers."
Posted by: Babs, Bucks dump on 8:15am Mon 12 Feb 07
its interesting that the trial will start in April when the lighter evenings are I wonder what it will be like in the middle of winter when its dark by 4pm, naughty arent they?
its interesting that the trial will start in April when the lighter evenings are I wonder what it will be like in the middle of winter when its dark by 4pm, naughty arent they?
Posted by: cynical b'stard on 8:20am Mon 12 Feb 07
Valid point Babs. I wonder what the CPRE's perspective of it wil be when TVP Traffic Division are scraping bodies off the road in the dark owing to no Streetlighting. Another ill-thought plan from BCC - I do wonder how they come up with their generally Anal ideas.
Valid point Babs. I wonder what the CPRE's perspective of it wil be when TVP Traffic Division are scraping bodies off the road in the dark owing to no Streetlighting. Another ill-thought plan from BCC - I do wonder how they come up with their generally Anal ideas.
Posted by: Alan Walters, 369-136 on 10:08am Mon 12 Feb 07
Thats your opinion 'Laura' to which you are perfectly entitled. I might add, however, that you were unearthed as a BCC Employee in another post, so we would expect you to have a blinkered, biased opinion towards your Employer's Policies. I would respectfully ask you to go back to your Ivory Tower, put back on your Rose-Tinted Glasses, and let the 'Peasants' who pay your exorbitant Salaries, carry on expressing [italic][bold]their[/bold][/italic] opinion uninterrupted by arrogant Civil Servants like yourself. Good Bile!!
Thats your opinion 'Laura' to which you are perfectly entitled. I might add, however, that you were unearthed as a BCC Employee in another post, so we would expect you to have a blinkered, biased opinion towards your Employer's Policies. I would respectfully ask you to go back to your Ivory Tower, put back on your Rose-Tinted Glasses, and let the 'Peasants' who pay your exorbitant Salaries, carry on expressing their opinion uninterrupted by arrogant Civil Servants like yourself. Good Bile!!
Posted by: Alan Walters, 369-136 on 11:33am Mon 12 Feb 07
Laura, im sorry i take it all back.....i was worng to say what i did in a moment of anger, being a respectable member of the community i should think before i speak and realise that the people in your position do alot of work for the people of the areas of High Wycombe. My wife has recently left me for a 23 year old kitchen fitter who has webbed feet. Its hit me very hard and im spending alot of time in chatrooms and blogs at the moment to escape from the reality of the situation. i should learn to keep calm in these situations and once agin i apologise for directing my anger at you. im very lonely
Laura, im sorry i take it all back.....i was worng to say what i did in a moment of anger, being a respectable member of the community i should think before i speak and realise that the people in your position do alot of work for the people of the areas of High Wycombe. My wife has recently left me for a 23 year old kitchen fitter who has webbed feet. Its hit me very hard and im spending alot of time in chatrooms and blogs at the moment to escape from the reality of the situation. i should learn to keep calm in these situations and once agin i apologise for directing my anger at you. im very lonely
[quote]“The review was measured on how much light shined upwards compared to facing the ground.”[/quote]
The above statement would indicate there is a problem with the design of the street lights, perhaps some for of shade put over the light would stop the problem rather than turning them all off?
[quote]“Between January 2001 and December 31, 2004 there have been two fatal, six serious and 32 slight collisions on the Hughenden Road.”[/quote]
Obviously it’s a dangerous stretch of road, surely it would be a silly idea to turn the lights off?
[quote]“Peter Cleasby, 57, chairman of CPRE, said: "We would be in favour of getting rid of unnecessary lighting which prevents people from seeing the sky clearly.”[/quote]
Exactly how many people are going to want to look up and see the stars? The drivers and pedestrians should be more concerned by keeping their eyes on the road to ensure they don’t have an accident.
If they wanted to turn the lights off to save money why not turn off the lights on one side of the road leaving the other side lit? This way there would still be some lighting and they could save 50% on the electricity bill, or is that too simple?
[bold]With the saving in electricity I take it that our council tax bills are going to be reduced?[/bold]
“The review was measured on how much light shined upwards compared to facing the ground.”
The above statement would indicate there is a problem with the design of the street lights, perhaps some for of shade put over the light would stop the problem rather than turning them all off?
“Between January 2001 and December 31, 2004 there have been two fatal, six serious and 32 slight collisions on the Hughenden Road.”
Obviously it’s a dangerous stretch of road, surely it would be a silly idea to turn the lights off?
“Peter Cleasby, 57, chairman of CPRE, said: "We would be in favour of getting rid of unnecessary lighting which prevents people from seeing the sky clearly.”
Exactly how many people are going to want to look up and see the stars? The drivers and pedestrians should be more concerned by keeping their eyes on the road to ensure they don’t have an accident.
If they wanted to turn the lights off to save money why not turn off the lights on one side of the road leaving the other side lit? This way there would still be some lighting and they could save 50% on the electricity bill, or is that too simple?
With the saving in electricity I take it that our council tax bills are going to be reduced?
Posted by: I'm not the only one on 8:58pm Mon 12 Feb 07
If we had MORE LIGHT maybe, I wouldn't have been the victim of crime THREE TIMES in recent years.
As a nation we should ALL stop paying our council taxes until we get value for money.
If we had MORE LIGHT maybe, I wouldn't have been the victim of crime THREE TIMES in recent years.
As a nation we should ALL stop paying our council taxes until we get value for money.
Posted by: Daniel Clarke, Tylers Green (HP10) on 8:38pm Mon 19 Feb 07
Surely if the reasoning behind this is to reduce light pollution and not costs, then they will put the 'saved' money into repairing roads and utilising the legally required and already (hopefully) present light from cars headlights instead?... I.e. replacing all of the non-functional catseyes that are abound the roads of Wycombe.
I live in Tylers Green (or Penn if you're feeling posh and coming from Hazlemere instead of up **** Lane) and there are no street lights. I live on a 'private drive' aka dirt track so I am quite used to this now. This wouldn't be a problem if the catseyes worked and the supposedly existent lines on the road were visible. However, as it is, you're more likely to be blinded by the shear intensity of the lights of a (for example) Mercedes whilst jolting through the collapsed drains all the way up New Road! Oh yes, very rural, very safe.
Surely if the reasoning behind this is to reduce light pollution and not costs, then they will put the 'saved' money into repairing roads and utilising the legally required and already (hopefully) present light from cars headlights instead?... I.e. replacing all of the non-functional catseyes that are abound the roads of Wycombe.
I live in Tylers Green (or Penn if you're feeling posh and coming from Hazlemere instead of up **** Lane) and there are no street lights. I live on a 'private drive' aka dirt track so I am quite used to this now. This wouldn't be a problem if the catseyes worked and the supposedly existent lines on the road were visible. However, as it is, you're more likely to be blinded by the shear intensity of the lights of a (for example) Mercedes whilst jolting through the collapsed drains all the way up New Road! Oh yes, very rural, very safe.
Posted by: johnymac, hazlemere on 11:04pm Wed 22 Aug 07
i came home from aylesbury to night an junctions at stoke mandaville wendover and missednen all had lights turne d off and all i can say its an accident waiting to happen and at missenden i couldnt even find the junction and i regulary take that route its ok for people to moan bout light pollution and that at what expense its an accident waiting to happen
i came home from aylesbury to night an junctions at stoke mandaville wendover and missednen all had lights turne d off and all i can say its an accident waiting to happen and at missenden i couldnt even find the junction and i regulary take that route its ok for people to moan bout light pollution and that at what expense its an accident waiting to happen
Posted by: Wayne Gillions, Aylesbury on 8:52pm Thu 30 Aug 07
I agree with above. This is ridiculous. You cannot put a price on safety, after all thats why the lights are there. As for light pollution, there are plenty of street lamps which can dramatically reduce light pollution. On a stretch of the M6, there are street lamps which shine downwards only. When it's foggy you can clearly see the beam of light shining down, with none being beamed upwwards. Naturally there will be a degree of refection from the road etc, but this is going to be minimal.............
£15k a year? How much has it cost BCC to implement this, errect signage etc etc??
I agree with above. This is ridiculous. You cannot put a price on safety, after all thats why the lights are there. As for light pollution, there are plenty of street lamps which can dramatically reduce light pollution. On a stretch of the M6, there are street lamps which shine downwards only. When it's foggy you can clearly see the beam of light shining down, with none being beamed upwwards. Naturally there will be a degree of refection from the road etc, but this is going to be minimal.............
£15k a year? How much has it cost BCC to implement this, errect signage etc etc??
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